09 September 2009

Can you imagine...

...the spittle-flecked left-o-spheric furor... (and yes, Dawg - I'm talkin' about you)... if kids at a Toronto school sang the "White National Anthem"?

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FROM THE COMMENTS:

"Will the school have a "White History Month"... because a "Black History Month" would appear to be rather superfluous."
And the compassionate, intellectual left responds...
"What does it mean to be Canadian? Act like a white boy and shut up?"
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26 comments:

Neo Conservative said...

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[from the article]

"Reading from a projection screen in the Sheppard Public School gymnasium they now share, the 115 students at the first Africentric school yesterday sang Canada's national anthem and the Black National Anthem by an early 1990s U.S. civil rights activist."

so... a segregated school... separate water fountains, so to speak. and hey, a separate national anthem.

and they're doing this in the name of harmony & inclusiveness?

seriously?

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langmann said...

I cannot think of a better way to make the KKK's, Hitler's and all those demon's dream come true.

Then again it does prove what we already knew: the left is racist.

oxygentax said...

On the bright side, this:

Today I pledge to be the best possible me

No matter how good I am, I know that I can become better.

Today I pledge to build On the work of yesterday

Which will lead me into the rewards of tomorrow.

sounds like conservative values. Think the socialists and teachers realized that?

langmann said...

There is a plus side, oxy. All kids need to learn that. If they back it up with real education and expectations then they won't hurt them like they usually do.

In the meantime the next step they'll be proposing is creating ghettos for them all to live in...

Oh wait they already do.

Philanthropist said...

Apartheid education in Canada. Maybe there are other educational practices we can import? Not educating girls would save a lot of money for example, budget's are always tight at the Board of Ed, why not try that out?

Neo Conservative said...

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"langmann says... All kids need to learn that"

geez... that's sounds so familiar... what's that called again?

oh yeah... "parenting".

your kid doesn't know any of this by the time they go to school... you have no business having children in the first place.

and please don't anyone dare bring the civil rights struggles of the 60's into this.

martin luther king would be sick to his stomach over the re-introduction of segragation of any kind.

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JA Goneaux said...

I wonder: will the school have a "White History Month"? A "Black History Month" would appear to be rather superfluous...

Neo Conservative said...

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well, james... maybe we shouldn't be so skeptical.

look at how well 'self-imposed segregation' is working out for canada's aboriginal community.

"The rate of deaths from injuries is 3 to 4 times higher for Aboriginal children than for other children in Canada."

Source: Government of Canada (2002) Healthy Canadians – A Federal Report on Comparable Health Indicators 2002. Ottawa: Health Canada.

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oxygentax said...

Neo -

Yes, it's parenting, but it's refreshing to see teachers and schools indoctrinating THAT motto rather than the usual "you're too useless to get by on your own" rhetoric.

Neo Conservative said...

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"oxygentax says... refreshing to see teachers and schools indoctrinating THAT motto"

hmmm, how about... "you're too useless to get by, unless you're grouped with a statistically insignificant, self-identified group of your cultural peers"?

there's a builder-upper, huh?

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Rob Budde said...

This is not forced segregation but a choice to celebrate difference. You cannot compare this to apartheid or First Nations' reserves because those were not voluntary. There is an aboriginal choice school opening in my town and I think it is great. Why not? It will meet all 'curriculum' requirements.

Neo Conservative said...

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"rob 'grey owl' budde says... It will meet all 'curriculum' requirements."

rob... please pull up some statistics on the abysmal failures of the aboriginal communities to protect, (see link above) never mind succesfully educate their children.

aboriginal reserves are, across the board, currently a segregated cesspool of crime, susbstance abuse and domestic violence... and even a blind cheerleader like yourself has to acknowledge their monumental failure.

canada spends 11 billion dollars a year to prop up this rotting system.

and maybe a guy who defends the murder of a quebec cop by the oka mohawks isn't exactly a neutral observer, huh?

p.s. -- you really think mlk would be applauding this development?

seriously?

on the other hand, i'm guessing james earle ray would be ecstatic.

and you're good with that?

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langmann said...

Rob, except it is a difference that is not worth celebrating. IN this day and age people go into the real workforce and cooperate with other people who are difference races.

If you're spending your whole time at a school where you know you're the only race allowed there, where the history you're taught is that white people hate you (an illegitmate scewed history): do you think you're going to come out of there without an innate mistrust of other races?

Neo Conservative said...

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"langmann says... do you think you're going to come out of there without an innate mistrust..."

c'mon now... don't be so negative... look at how well that sort of "education" is working out for the palestinians...

"Three years ago, we did a study on children in Gaza between the ages of 12 and 14, and we asked them, what would you like to be when you are 18?" Sarraj said. "At that time, 36 percent of boys said, 'I would like to be a martyr,' and 17 percent of the girls said the same."

Two years ago, the station created a Mickey Mouse-style character that encouraged "violent resistance" against Israel and simulated the use of an AK-47 and grenades.

let the healing begin.

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Rob Budde said...

No, no, you are missing the point and making false comparisons. The "choice" schools are just that, and anyone can enroll. So the aboriginal school here will be in town and have any number of ethnicities involved. It will also be properly funded whereas reserve institutions and infrastructure are not. And before you protest, I have been on reserves and know what it there and why. And the comparison to Palestinians is just, well, waaaay out there. This type of school is a perfect balance of "one country one law" (Neo) and a recognition of the variety that exists in our culture.

Neo Conservative said...

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to be honest rob... i stopped listening to you after you attempted to justify the murder of officer marcel lemay, of the surete du quebec, who was shot and killed by an aboriginal terrorist at the Oka standoff.

remember what you said then, rob?

"Yes, yes, marcel lemay, you've mentioned him already, got it. He shouldn't have been there."

uh-huh... in your sovereign aboriginal apartheid state, right?

the one we taxpayers prop up, to the tune of 11 billion dollars annually?

sorry, my socialist friend... no sale.

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langmann said...

No matter how you spin it Rob, I am never going to get behind segregation - even if it is supposed to be voluntary for the "best interests" of those segregated.

Why?

First, because history has taught us that segregation leads to discrimination and violence.

Second because my close Jewish ancestors, who are all dead from an overdose of a certain gas knew full well what segregation in their best interests led to.

We need to learn how to get along regardless of color, religion, or sex...

I know you mean well but maybe one day you'll get it.

Rob Budde said...

Langmann--to say "it is a difference that is not worth celebrating" really is demeaning. It is hard to take your argument seriously after that. I agree segregation has been historically loaded and dangerous but this is something different. Again, false comparisons. If it was the government saying this or that group had to go to a separate school then I would be alarmed, but when it is a grassroots movement by the group in order to preserve culture (Multiculturalism Act 1988) in the face of a culture that threatens to erase difference, then it is a different issue.

Neo, I did not "justify the murder of officer marcel lemay"--I've said before and will again--his death was unfortunate and a crime. What I pointed to was a historical context for that event that made it more complicated--a history you were ignoring. So, bringing that up over and over is getting tired. Especially when it has nothing to do with what we're discussing now.

Neo Conservative said...

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"rob budde says... a historical context for that event that made it more complicated"

rob... let me "uncomplicate" this for you... your terrorist friends shot a police office in the face and killed him.

and hey... let's run some "historical context" past officer lemay's widow & the children he left behind... i'm sure that'll make it all better.

here, robbie... say it with me... mur...der, hom...i...cide.

practice up for a while you silly boy... and then come back & see us.

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Rob Budde said...

One cop, thousands in First Nations genocide. You do the math.

I already said "crime." Can you say "social justice"?

Neo Conservative said...

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"pinko rob tries to deal... Can you say "social justice?"

no rob... the killing of officer lemay was cold-blooded murder.

you and your aboriginal buddies don't get to appoint yourselves executioners... whatever your grievance.

see... this is canada... we don't even execute the pauls & karlas of the world.

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langmann said...

If you think the difference between white and black skin is worth celebrating, Robbie then go join the rest of the KKK or Black Panthers. Moreover saying all black people have the same culture (making a separate school relevant) is like saying all Europeans have the same culture or "Asians". They don't. Plus in North America after so many generations not many people even remember what that culture is.

In this century in North America there is absolutely no reason for a separate school. You haven't even explained how it is relevant.

I'll tell you again. In the 1930's some Jewish Ghettos came about because some Jewish leaders and those of the Nazi regime both thought it would be a good idea to separate the Jews due to a cultural divide and the persistant presecution of Jews.

It is no different from people like you thinking there is a good reason for segregation. You guys love to walk around talking about MLK but it is obvious you've never listened.

Secondly if you want to talk about the Mohawk and Iroquois Five Nations you need to read and learn some unbiased history. Not all Native belong to the "same friendly nation" you seem to think. When encountered by European countries the natives existed in a somewhat feudal and small nation states in many ways no different from European nation states. The Mohawks were active in attacking and exterminating other native nations to control a fur trade with the Dutch and were allies of the French and British during various wars. When they were given some territory in Ontario and Quebec it was not necessarily all original Mohawk land. In these parts of Ontario, it was actually land owned by the Neutal Nation that had been exterminated by the Mohawk years earlier. Joseph Brant chose to sell parts of their land to settlers in return hoping his people would learn how to become farmers and earn a livelihood. Brant realized that if his people were to survive they would have to learn new ways. Some Mohawks also chose to sell their land and return to the United States with wealth.

It is a complicated history and not simple. In most ways the Mohawk were treated as equals by other European nations at the time. The issue of who owns the land in these particular land claims is in some ways uncertain and in other ways clear due to documentation. For most part in this case it is often clear that the Mohawks do not own some of the land they claim they do, and it is due to the fact they sold it.

Either way when I look back on those times they have nothing to do with me. The courts can decide these particular land claims based on evidence, but it needs to be done and enforced.

rbudde said...

Good post langmann. Thanks for addressing the issue more directly.

I agree "saying all black people have the same culture (making a separate school relevant) is like saying all Europeans have the same culture or "Asians". They don't." I am not sure how that school will deal with that issue. Presumable there will be a recognition of those differences.

And I agree "in North America after so many generations not many people even remember what that culture is"--but think that schools like this one are meant to address that.

"In this century in North America there is absolutely no reason for a separate school. You haven't even explained how it is relevant." The relevance, as I see it, is that many minorities in Canada suffer from a lack of identity because identity is denied them via legislation (First Nations) or a dominant Eurocentric culture (African-Canadian). The relevance of a school like this is to instill cultural pride and an identity that is both Canadian and African-based. This is just the reality in Canada; there are a growing number of visible minorities that are demanding to have both. And why not? What does it jeopardize? You don't have to go to this school.

"In the 1930's some Jewish Ghettos came about because some Jewish leaders and those of the Nazi regime both thought it would be a good idea to separate the Jews due to a cultural divide and the persistant presecution of Jews." I did not know this. I assumed it was forced segregation. But I still think this is different in that no ill intent is involved.

As for the Iroquois and Mohawk being a "complicated history and not simple", I agree and know that there are no saints involved. My argument was that the Oka affair had land claim issues involved and came out of a legitimate land claim stalemate, one of many that did and still exist across the nation. It is not "just" a bunch of "terrorists" looking to shoot a cop.

Early on I asked Neo to imagine himself in First Nations shoes and how he would react to his nations' lands being taken over and reserves set up (true segregation) and his culture (language, ceremonies) made illegal. This is our history that we continually disavow or deny or say "it is not my problem" or "nothing to do with me" but it is our history. The ramifications are facing us now.

Neo Conservative said...

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rob budde says... I asked Neo to imagine himself in First Nations shoes and how he would react to his nations' lands being taken over"

rob... my people had their asses thrown out of ireland a couple of hundred years ago.

are you saying that this would somehow justify my shooting prince charles?

and, forgive me, but people in this country could always choose to be canadian, couldn't they?

stop me if you've heard this before, rob... one people, one law.

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rbudde said...

Neo said: "and, forgive me, but people in this country could always choose to be canadian, couldn't they?"

That's such a complicated question though. What does it mean to be Canadian? Act like a white boy and shut up? Thing is, Canadian means diversity. Being Canadian means celebrating ethnicity and when that is taken away, that act is what is un-Canadian.

Neo Conservative said...

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"rob budde totally immerses his head in the bucket of kool-ade... What does it mean to be Canadian? Act like a white boy and shut up?"

well, robbie... if your theory is true... i guess i've failed miserably, on the shutting up part anyway.

and, as you seem to be claiming that you are some sort of ethnological expert... what exactly does it mean to "act like a white boy"?

you can tell what race someone is... by mannerisms, or what they eat? what, pray tell, do you act like?

sounds a little, er... racist AND anal.

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